Talk:Synthesis Items
The list of Synth Items we have listed so far is becoming a sizeable list, so it may be a good idea to figure out a method of sorting real soon. If it helps, I have a typed version of the 654 synth items for sale from the convert shop I can paste wherever. However, I have noticed there is a good ammount of missing items from the synth store's list (SS weapon ingredients do not seem to be for sale for example), so it would not be a complete list in the least. A few things I have noticed regarding the convert shop list: *There does seem to be a few "groupings" of synth items that I have noticed so far, such as the character specific generic items (Foxfire Flame, Caged Fangstone, etc) and elemental type items ( Wind Crystal, Wind Lump, Wind Element, Earth Crystal, Earth Lump, Earth Element, etc). *A quick glance at the convert list's topmost items suggests Tier'd drop items that all drop for the same enemy type but differ depending on the enemy's level (Venom, Venom Needle, and Deadly Needle all drop from wasp enemies I believe). These "groupings" vary in length from 3-5 items. *From what I have observed so far, it would seem synth items for SS weapons are only used in that specific recipe and nowhere else. Items also can be sorted through the dungeon types they appear in, as pirate themed items don't seem to drop in fantasy garden themed dungeons, etc. Any thoughs on how to continue from here would be greatly appreciated. Nesirus] 08:01, August 8, 2010 (UTC) : I'd say using your Convert Shop list of items would best be served in a Convert Shop article. At this point I can't suggest using a template nor using a PurchaseLocation tag, since the Convert Shop is in a whole other league of its own. I'll edit a few templates to allow the addition of Convert Shop prices (Convert to points price; Purchase price) and we'll see where it goes from there. As for creating groupings for items, I've paid so little attention that I have no idea how to go about listing the items. Perhaps using a sortable table like on the Borderlands Wiki's Achievements Page would work out well, provided items are sorted by "family" or "dungeon". That leaves sorting power in the hands of the person searching, with the default possibly being the regular order of items in the inventory screen. Thoughts? LanceHeart 13:47, August 8, 2010 (UTC) :: An inventory screen ordered listing would be nice to have, there's been a number of times where even knowing the relative position would speed up having to scroll through the list. Of course, other user selectable sort options would be ideal. Coax75ohm 17:46, August 8, 2010 (UTC) Okay, took a look at that achievement page and I love it. I'm not too familiar with templates yet, so it'll take some time for me to get this into something that looks respectable. As for the potential columns on the convert page, I'm thinking Icon, Name, Buy Price(cp), Sell Price(cp), CP->Gala/Gala->CP Ratio's, Family. Family would be in regards to which dungeon type they drop in. Might have to make pages for each family to clearly define item sets. I'm also wondering if it's gonna be okay putting the entire shop on one page, since I'm guessing there's nearly a thousand entries. Additionally, I don't think its a big deal to make a category for CP cost/GP->Gala ratio, seeing as if someone is curious to that figure they would probably come to the convert page. I do want to have some sort of indicator of whether or not an item is sold at the convert shop, such as a PurchaseLocation category link, or at least some sort of "Yes/No" prompt on the Item's page. I am working on the template at the moment, so any input would be appreciated. Nesirus 00:15, August 9, 2010 (UTC) If it helps, I just made a cleaned up version of the SynthItems list originally posted on Gamespot. Ran the list through a quick Perl filter, then went through and fixed a few typos by hand, should be mostly good. This is ONLY synthesis, aka bag icon, items from the convert shop, there are some others that I don't think are in this list. A few things to watch out for: misspellings: Royal Insiginia/Royal Insignia, War Memoires/War Memories multiple items with the same name: Exorcism Charm, Steel Wheel Complete list Also let me know if you any help converting long lists into wiki format, I know the various unix text mangling utilities fairly well. Coax75ohm 01:53, August 9, 2010 (UTC) Oh man, I wish I had seen that list before I spent an hour typing out my own, haha. As for the typos, there's a ridiculous amount in the game, so as long as we type it as it appears in game, we should be ok. As for the dupes, Cursed Vestige and Twin Scorn are actually listed twice in the list; I'm considering just leaving them in place so the placement numbers don't shift. As you mentioned, this is NOT a complete list of synth ingredients, as it would seem SS weapon materials are not sold in the convert shop. I will gladly take you up on your offer regarding the list converting part as soon as the base formatting is done on the convert shop page. I'm thinking we should start a temp page with a listing of synth items that don't appear in the convert shop. I have 22 synth items left after selling as many of the others as possible, but I only see 4 of them scrolling though the weapon synth, not sure what the other's are for since they don't seem to appear in the list I just posted. For the typos, both pages should exist, one being a redirect. For the dupes, I already did a bit of work on Exorcism Charm, trying to get everything straight. Coax75ohm 02:26, August 9, 2010 (UTC) Also, since you did a separate list, could you post it on pastebin or similar, I'd like to run a diff on the two in order to check for any remaining typos. Coax75ohm 02:38, August 9, 2010 (UTC) One final thing, looks like we both missed a dupe: $ sort SynthItems | uniq -d Cursed Vestige Exorcism Charm Necrolite Steel Wheel Twin Scorn Coax75ohm 02:52, August 9, 2010 (UTC) My list link: http://pastebin.com/VUY337WM Most of the misspelled items in my list are intentional as they appear that way in game, but I am not 100% sure I didn't mess any up unintentionally. My list contains the entire page, including consumable items, ores, bars, special souls, etc. I agree with the temp page idea; I started listing items I noticed I could sell for cp but weren't on the original buy list, but I haven't gone through each item to see what it's used for. Also, the dupes I was referring to in my earlier post were double listings of the same item in the shop list, and not dupes in general. For regular dupes, I gave naming priority to the one most likely to appear as a drop that needed to be input into dungeon templates or w/e, and renamed the other with a tag in parenthesis, while leaving a note on either page (Eternal Soul and Eternal Soul (Synth Item) for example) Nesirus 03:04, August 9, 2010 (UTC) Thank you, your list helped a lot, I still missed a couple things. This list should be 100%, but it wouldn't hurt to have someone else check it. For the misspellings, I think the in-game spelling should take precedence, with the correct spelling being a redirect. Coax75ohm 04:12, August 9, 2010 (UTC) Took me a bit to get your comment about the dupes, my list of 5 dupes above is from the convert shop synth item list, it's not general but granted it probably covers most if not all. I agree that a note needs to be made on the dupe pages, and I've done so on the Exorcism Charm pages. Though I don't like either of the naming schemes so far "(2)" is ugly, and "(Synth Item)" isn't exactly right either since they are both technically synth items, albeit one is more rare. I need sleep Not sure of a better naming scheme though. Coax75ohm 04:30, August 9, 2010 (UTC) I agree with you in regards to the in-game spellings taking precedence. Honestly, I dont care for the (Synth Item) tag either, cause as you pointed out, they are both synth items. However, I figured it would be a pain to have to type out " (Soul)" everytime someone found a monster or treasure as the "soul" version seems to be way more common than the non soul version. I really don't have any good ideas on disambiguation in regards to dupe naming, so I'll just continue as I have been until we come up with a better method. Just looked through my list searching for the dupes you listed. I was able to find the 2 I mentioned earlier by going into the "sell for cp" shop and comparing my list for missing items. Interestingly enough, Necrolite and Steel Wheel are both listed for sale in 2 different spots for the same price. However, this is not the case in Exorcism Charm, which is sellable for 5cp in the top-most version, and 3 cp in the bottom-most version. I'm not sure what to make of this, wether its just a typo, or there are 2 synth items with the exact same name but different uses. If the latter is the case, we're gonna have more trouble figuring out what to do with those types of items. --Just looked at my sell list again, I have 6 Exorcism Charm's that sell for 5cp and only 1 that sells for 3cp. Going to confirm if the other 4 are dupe names, or actual seperate items. Nesirus 04:52, August 9, 2010 (UTC) Steel Wheel, Exorcism Charm, are different items with the same name. Cursed Vestige, Twin Scorn appear 2x in the buy list but only once in the sell list, so hopefully they are singular items. Necrolite appears 2x in both lists, but as I have one of each item, I am unsure if this is just a double listing, or I just happen to have 1 of either item. Edit: turns out Necrolite falls into the category of double named items. So Steel Wheel, Exorcism Charm, and Necrolite are duped, and only Exorcism Charm has any notable difference (cp value). Now going to look at descriptions of the items to see if there is some way to tell them apart, so far Exorcism Charm and Necrolite dupes have different details.Nesirus 05:01, August 9, 2010 (UTC) Alright, after reviewing the 5 pairs, it would seem Cursed Vestige and Twin Scorn are not dupes, as their details are repeated on either item. Steel Wheel, Exorcism Charm, and Necrolite each have a different description for either item (or lack thereof), so that is how we will be able to tell the 2 apart. I'm not sure how we will tell them apart when picking them up through drops or chests in-game, but as for the synthesis ingredients, we could make sure to have, lets say, 10 of type #1, and 5 of type #2, and see how many of the item we own in each of the synth recipes in question. You're right about Cursed Vestige and Twin Scorn, if you go into the convert shop and buy one of the item then scroll to the "dupe," the Have quantity for both will be the same. Now I'm thinking of buying one of everything in the convert shop and checking the list against how it appears in the Item Browse menu, maybe later today... might matter if we're going to include inventory ordered sort listing. Coax75ohm 14:20, August 9, 2010 (UTC) As for telling the difference, the synth recipes are how I first discovered there were two different versions of Exorcism Charm. I had a bunch in my inventory but the synth said I had zero, then going into one of the vending machines I saw the item listed with a Have quantity of zero, bought a couple and rechecked the recipe, there they were... Coax75ohm 14:39, August 9, 2010 (UTC) I've gone through and checked the inventory order. Cursed Vestige and Twin Scorn only appear once, while Odd Yojiran and Gravity Crystal are in different positions, other than that everything else is the same. All the non-convert shop items appear to be after Elysium Cape in the list, I've also started a temp page to help create a complete list of these items. Coax75ohm 18:29, August 12, 2010 (UTC) Added my list of non shop items, more or less in order that they appear. There will probably be some out of order because I was missing about 5-6 of the items you listed. Most of the items appear to be SS wep materials, but I did notice the "Fragment" types are used in the white meteorites in the meteor lab. We probably won't see the specifics of these items until our database is a bit fuller.Nesirus 04:00, August 13, 2010 (UTC) Not sure if this is common knowledge or not, but we've got an auto-compiling list of pages that use the SynthItem template at http://triuni.wikia.com/wiki/Category:SynthItem that automatically sorts all of the items alphabetically that use the template. It would be simple enough to copy the synthitem teplate and rename the copies "oreitem" or "soulitem" if we didnt want those synth items to be mixed in. Would it be possible to use this page as opposed to the one we've been updating with new entries every time we find a new item? Nesirus 07:50, August 13, 2010 (UTC) :And yay, almost all of the synth items are now in that list ;) We shouldn't remove the SynthItem tag from anything that has a bag icon, though there's no reason why items can't have multiple categories. Guess it depends on what we're planning to do with this page. Coax75ohm 04:49, August 14, 2010 (UTC)